After playing some¹ Into the Breach here are some ideas before I forget them entirely :
- If we keep it a simultaneous combat system (one turn per Galactic turn, rather than half a turn per Galactic turn, by doing one player move one turn then the other move the next turn) then we can't really have the "move and shoot" system that the player in ItB uses.
This because each player won't know where the enemy will be after they move, and ItB system requires to shoot precisely on the target one wants (since the idea is to combine effects); it can't be a "shoot at whoever is available" order.
- This means that we'll need to use instead the "shoot and move" system that the Veks (the NPC antagonist) uses in ItB : the shooting orders will then be directed precisely at the targets the player wants, and the skill will be in moving one's Mechas to positions where they'll be able to shoot the enemy where the player guesses he may be at the end of the next turn.
- This means that movement control will be one of the most essential tactical skill, and we should build the combat system around that.
Mostly through Zone of Control and similar things, rather than through Mechas abilities (these would of course be fun and useful, but shouldn't be the main aspect; ZoCs and using terrain to blockade enemies and constrain their movements should be the core principle).
- The timing constraint in ItB is an integral part of the fun, and probably we should integrate some of it into the FreeOrion Ground Combat system.
- Timing constraints are a good way to keep the ground combat balanced and strategic even when the forces in presence are unbalanced, so that it never gets tedious and always has some elements of suspense/strategic relevance in it.
- Imho the best way to do that would be a way to have the superior force able to pursue multiple objectives simultaneously (so it's worth it to invest in a large invasion or defense force) while making success in each of these objectives dependent on skill rather than brute force.
- A good way to do that would be through bets and antes, where each player bets that they can achieve some objective in a limited number of turns - the lower ball gets to try, and is rewarded if they succeed, punished if they fail.
That would use the Tower Defense system that Ophiuchus proposed, so as to be done entirely in one Galactic turn.
- Not sure how to actually implement that : probably have task forces of Mechas sent to a particular objective (science lab for stealing a tech, HQ for a spying operation, whatever); those Mechas would be removed from the general combat for a set number of Galactic turns (determined by the player) and each of these GT would provide a number of rounds to achieve the mission (against the enemy "tower defense", so in single player) ?
For example 4 rounds per Galactic turn, to be consistent with the Spatial Combat System.
So the opposing player could intervene (by dispatching their own Mechas to the objective) only after the 4 single player turns have been played.
- To make it fun we'd probably need to have both the invading and defending forces have objectives that can be pursued this way (I mean, not have only the invading forces have these objectives and restrain the defender to only choose what to defend).
- Examples of objectives for the defender could be invader's Supply drops (if he gets them he destroys some of the invader's Mechas), Headquarters (if he gets them he can tell the space ships around the system to leave, impersonating their ground officer), Communication centers (if he gets enough them he invasion is delayed for a few Galactic turns), etc.
¹ Actually "way too much for my own good"
- If we keep it a simultaneous combat system (one turn per Galactic turn, rather than half a turn per Galactic turn, by doing one player move one turn then the other move the next turn) then we can't really have the "move and shoot" system that the player in ItB uses.
This because each player won't know where the enemy will be after they move, and ItB system requires to shoot precisely on the target one wants (since the idea is to combine effects); it can't be a "shoot at whoever is available" order.
- This means that we'll need to use instead the "shoot and move" system that the Veks (the NPC antagonist) uses in ItB : the shooting orders will then be directed precisely at the targets the player wants, and the skill will be in moving one's Mechas to positions where they'll be able to shoot the enemy where the player guesses he may be at the end of the next turn.
- This means that movement control will be one of the most essential tactical skill, and we should build the combat system around that.
Mostly through Zone of Control and similar things, rather than through Mechas abilities (these would of course be fun and useful, but shouldn't be the main aspect; ZoCs and using terrain to blockade enemies and constrain their movements should be the core principle).
- The timing constraint in ItB is an integral part of the fun, and probably we should integrate some of it into the FreeOrion Ground Combat system.
- Timing constraints are a good way to keep the ground combat balanced and strategic even when the forces in presence are unbalanced, so that it never gets tedious and always has some elements of suspense/strategic relevance in it.
- Imho the best way to do that would be a way to have the superior force able to pursue multiple objectives simultaneously (so it's worth it to invest in a large invasion or defense force) while making success in each of these objectives dependent on skill rather than brute force.
- A good way to do that would be through bets and antes, where each player bets that they can achieve some objective in a limited number of turns - the lower ball gets to try, and is rewarded if they succeed, punished if they fail.
That would use the Tower Defense system that Ophiuchus proposed, so as to be done entirely in one Galactic turn.
- Not sure how to actually implement that : probably have task forces of Mechas sent to a particular objective (science lab for stealing a tech, HQ for a spying operation, whatever); those Mechas would be removed from the general combat for a set number of Galactic turns (determined by the player) and each of these GT would provide a number of rounds to achieve the mission (against the enemy "tower defense", so in single player) ?
For example 4 rounds per Galactic turn, to be consistent with the Spatial Combat System.
So the opposing player could intervene (by dispatching their own Mechas to the objective) only after the 4 single player turns have been played.
- To make it fun we'd probably need to have both the invading and defending forces have objectives that can be pursued this way (I mean, not have only the invading forces have these objectives and restrain the defender to only choose what to defend).
- Examples of objectives for the defender could be invader's Supply drops (if he gets them he destroys some of the invader's Mechas), Headquarters (if he gets them he can tell the space ships around the system to leave, impersonating their ground officer), Communication centers (if he gets enough them he invasion is delayed for a few Galactic turns), etc.
¹ Actually "way too much for my own good"
Statistics: Posted by LienRag — Tue Mar 04, 2025 7:23 pm